Lilah

Sujet: Lilah Lun 15 Jan 2007, 19:01

Lilah Morgan, avocate belle, sexy et sans scrupule. Elle est prête à tout pour atteindre ses buts. L'une des seules femmes du cabinet d'avocat Wolfram&Hart doit user de pleins de ruses pour rivaliser contre collègues mâles.

Au fur et à mesure des saisons, on découvre de nouvelles facettes de ce personnage tantôt détestable tantôt adorable.

Qu'avez-vous pensé d'elle? L'avez-vous aimé? Sa relation avec Wesley vous a-t-elle plue? Sa mort vous a-t-elle émue?

Sujet: Re: Lilah Lun 15 Jan 2007, 21:14

Dans les saisons 1 et 2 j'accrochais pas tellement au personnage mais je la trouve beaucoup plus intéressante dans les 3 et 4, elle est super loyale envers W&H et pourtant elle tue quand même Billy et puis j'adore la complexité de sa relation avec Wesley, j'aurais aimé voir durer leur relation plus longtemps, voir son évolution, j'ai été déçue qu'elle meure.

Sujet: Re: Lilah Lun 15 Jan 2007, 22:17

Un perssonnage assez complexe et très attachant malgrè ses cotès sombres..moi aussi j'aurais aimè en voir d'avantage sur sa relation avec wes..il est clair pour moi que ses sentiments envers lui ètaient rèel et wes aussi tenait a elle.

Sujet: Re: Lilah Mar 16 Jan 2007, 10:37

J'adore ce personnage. Dans la saison 1 et 2, c'est vrai qu'elle était pas méga intéressante, mais j'aimais bien la voir interagir avec Lee (saison 1). Un peu moins dans la saison 2, elle semblait un peu trop craintive à mon goût...

Mais dans les saisons suivantes, elle est extra. Comme elle remet toujours Gavin à sa place. Ses interactions avec Angel et Cordy. Puis, à la fin avec Wes. Et dans la saison 4, sa relation avec Wes était génial. J'avais pas envie qu'elle meure. Heureusement qu'on la quand même revue de temps en temps ^^

Je l'apprécie mais en demi teinte je dirais.
Il est vrai qu'au départ,elle n'est pas réellement intéressante,elle m'agouille et voilà.

Par la suite,elle prend de l'importance mais j'ai détesté le fait qu'elle fasse envoyé de fausses visions à Cordy tout ça pour toucher Angel.

Sinon j'ai aimé sa relation avec Wes que je trouvais sincère.

Une bonne "méchante".
Son rôle dans la saison 1 et 2 est plutôt anecdotique mais elle se rattrape largement dans les deux suivantes.

J'aime sa froideur apparente, son côté "garce", ses répliques cinglantes. Ses menaces sous un sourire, son côté faussement détaché
Les confrontations angel/lilah ou celle de cordy/lilah sont superbes et intenses.

J'aimais bien sa relation avec wesley, on a découvert une autre facette d'elle. Sa mort est précipitée mais c'est pas ce genre de détails insignifiants qui vont l'empêcher de revenir faire son show.

Elle est apparue quelques fois très émouvantes. Notamment quand wesley essaye de brûler son contrat.

Un très bon second rôle!!

Cordy&Angel Nombre de messages : 2597 Age : 34 Date d'inscription : 16/02/2007

J'ai beaucoup aimé son personnage , et ça m'a fait "embeter" quand elle est morte ! Surtout tué par Cordelia ...

ilovecordy a écrit:: Je l'apprécie mais en demi teinte je dirais.
Il est vrai qu'au départ,elle n'est pas réellement intéressante,elle m'agouille et voilà.

Par la suite,elle prend de l'importance mais j'ai détesté le fait qu'elle fasse envoyé de fausses visions à Cordy tout ça pour toucher Angel.

Sinon j'ai aimé sa relation avec Wes que je trouvais sincère.

Du même avis que toi frèro. Wink

c'est pas un personage que je portais dans mon coeur, mais je l'aimais bine quand meme ! dommage qu'elle soit morte ! mais tant mieux que sa soit cordy qui l'ai tuée (contrairement a clement) c'est pas comme si c'était un simple demon ou vampire qu'il l'ai tuée !

Moi aussi j'ai préféré que ça soit Cordy qui s'en charge et pas un petit démon de passage.

ouai sa a marquer le coup au moin !

Oui, mais j'aurais quand même préféré que ce soit Angélus qui la tue.

Et puis ce n'est PAS Cordy qui la tue. C'est Jasmine, dans le corps de Cordy Lilah 686108

Sujet: Re: Lilah Lun 26 Mar 2007, 21:13

J'aime beaucoup son perso , elle est très maquiavélique . j'aime beaucoup sa "relation" avec Wesley

Sujet: Re: Lilah Mer 03 Sep 2008, 22:30

J'adore Lilah !! Même si elle passe un peu "inaperçue" dans les deux premières saisons, son rôle prend une plus grande ampleur en saison 3 et 4, et j'ai beaucoup apprécié. Toujours le mot pour "rire" ! lol. J'adore son répondant et son cynisme dans la plupart des situations. Ca a beau être pince sans rire, c'est quand même marrant !!

C'est dans sa relation avec Wesley que je l'ai trouvé la plus touchante. Elle a beau être maléfique et faire genre qu'elle a un coeur de pierre, je pense qu'elle avait de sincères sentiments pour Wes (d'autant qu'elle ne supportait pas l'idée qu'il soit plus intéressé par Fred que par elle !).

J'étais vachement triste quand j'ai vu qu'elle mourrait !! Je trouve qu'elle a beaucoup manqué, ça a fait un petit vide. J'adore la scène où Wes doit lui trancher la tête et où "ils" ont une petite conversation.

Un autre moment touchant, c'est quand Wes tente de brûler le contrat qui la lie à W & H. Comme quoi... il tenait quand même à elle.

Bref, j'adore vraiment Lilah ! L'une des "méchantes" que j'ai préféré...

Sujet: Re: Lilah Dim 14 Sep 2008, 14:48

Et, selon moi, ce qui a marqué doublement son absence, c'est qu'on l'ait remplacée par Eve. Cordy a beau l'avoir appelée Lilah Junior, elle ne lui arrivait pas à la cheville, même pas d'un cheveux sur la pointe des pieds!!! Et je parle même pas de ses interactions avec Lindsey...

Sujet: Re: Lilah Jeu 28 Jan 2010, 08:56

Je n'ai jamais vraiment aimé ce personnage mais j'aimais bien sa petite rivalité avec Lindsey elle se laissait pas faire j'aimais ça chez elle surtout en saison 3. Son couple avec Wesley m'a un peu dérangé au début mais au final j'ai bien aimé car son amour pour lui étai vraiment sincère et j'ai apprécié ça. C'est sûr que Eve ne lui arrive pas à la cheville.

Sujet: Re: Lilah Lun 14 Mar 2011, 20:40

Citation :: Lilah Morgan. Though it goes unstated, her full name is presumably Delilah -- I've never met someone who was just 'Lilah' on their birth certificate -- so perhaps that's a good place to start. Delilah (Hebrew Dlila, basically "one who has weakened another") is of course the woman in the Bible who seduces and entraps the hero Samson, depriving him of the magical locks of hair that give him strength. He is subsequently blinded by his enemies and imprisoned. Delilah is an archetypal seductress, and her motivation is a bribe offered by the Philistines, Samson's enemies. In a sense, she is the woman who betrays love in favor of material goods.

The three Wolfram & Hart attorneys presented in the early episodes of AtS -- Lindsey McDonald, Lilah Morgan and Lee Mercer -- are clearly meant to represent three different kinds of human temptation. Lindsey is ambitious evil -- he longs to make something of himself after an impoverished childhood, and his common modus operandi is offering people what they want (qv Kate Lockley, especially). Lee is wrathful evil -- he does what he does because it makes him more powerful than the people below him, but his pettiness and lack of social skills mean that there's a time limit on his threat level. Lilah is avaricious evil -- her work for Wolfram & Hart is motivated by her desire for comfort and luxury. We first meet her in 1.16 "The Ring", in which she is depicted as a well-dressed woman fond of fine wine and gambling large sums of money. Like the Biblical Delilah, she is motivated largely by a desire for material goods -- she underlines this in 4.12 "Calvary", when she says that what she misses most while on the run from The Beast is access to "all [her] pretty things."

The obvious symbolic point to make about the three attorneys (quickly whittled down to just Lilah and Lindsey by 1.21 "Blind Date") is that all three of them have the initials L.M. I'm not sure what this is meant to signify, and nobody ever comments on it in-series. One fan theory I recall reading was that it's meant to stand for Lucifer Morningstar, and there is a certain appeal to that reading. Certainly 'Morgan' evokes morgen, or morning -- morgenstern meaning "morning star".

If Lilah is one aspect of a Satanic triumverate, then, she is the aspect of the Devil most closely related to temptation. Certainly her office scene with Angel in "The Ring" is a sort of temptation of Christ in the wilderness, with Lilah offering him 'freedom' at the price of working with the firm. In effect, this scene is 4.22 "Home" in microcosm, which makes for a neat sort of bookend of Lilah's first episode and last episode. Lilah here acts as the seductive force pulling Angel toward the easy way out; the sexual charge to their conversation is undeniable, and she seems ready and willing to seduce him physically if it'll skew his opinion on the matter. Stephanie Romanov has said that after this episode she always played Lilah as though she were a 'scorned lover', reasoning that you couldn't hate someone as much as Lilah hates Angel without also kind of wanting to have sex with them.

It's notable that Lilah, as the only female attorney, is also the one most profoundly linked with sexuality as temptation from the outset. As the seductress who hates but also lusts after a male subject, Lilah reflects another archetypal character in the Judeo-Christian framework of Wolfram & Hart: Lilith, Adam's first wife, consort to demons, slayer of infants. Lilith was a Medieval-era creation based on the Arabic demon Lilitu and other tales of demonic women from Near Eastern and Greco-Byzantine traditions; in the Renaissance period she was often portrayed as the serpent in the Garden of Eden, and therefore sort of the female aspect of the Devil. 'Lilah' to 'Lilith' isn't all that big a stretch, and identifying Lilah with the child-snatching demoness adds an interesting new layer to the Season 3 Connor arc. Just some food for thought. It should also be remarked that what provokes Lilith to leave Adam in the first place is the fact that he won't let her take agency over her own sexuality, so yeah.

So that is my basic thought about Lilah's thematic place within the series and within the context of Wolfram & Hart: she is the avaricious seductress, the woman out for herself who likes to be on top both figuratively and sexually. The temptress in the garden.

Why is she my favorite villain? That's a complex question. I mean, on some level it is probably because she is a strong woman in control of her own life, and that is the kind of character that generally draws me (lol diva gay icons?? what are you talking about). Still, though, that's not quite it.

I think to get to the core point, I should share some quotes.

From 2.11 "Redefinition":
LILAH: Yeah, you know what I don't like about suspicion? The part where they find us two weeks from now, dead in some freak accident.
LINDSEY: I did nothing wrong.
LILAH: I'm sorry, have we met? Because I work for Wolfram & Hart.

From 2.15 "Reprise":
LINDSEY: Look: either we pass the review or we won't. You really think that a few last minute dark rites and rituals are gonna make a difference now?
LILAH: Everybody else seems to think so. I heard Henderson actually pulled her firstborn out of company daycare to offer it up to... (disgustedly) brown-noser. (sudden realization) My mother was right. I should have had children.

From 3.06 "Billy":
LILAH: I know the risks of my job and I accept them.
CORDELIA: Then why were you crying five minutes ago? There's not a thing about badly reapplied mascara that I don't know.
LILAH: I'm not Lindsey McDonald. I don't switch sides whenever it gets tough.

From 3.16 "Sleep Tight":
LILAH: Look, I've been doing this a long damn time. I've had to be better, smarter, quicker than every man at Wolfram & Hart.
ANGEL: So, it's a feminist thing. (to bartender) It's on her.
LILAH: It's a survival thing. I made a lot of devil's bargains, and I stuck to them. As a result I live somewhat dangerously, and quite comfortably. My mother, who no longer recognizes me, has the best room at the clinic. I get up every morning, put on my game face, and do what I have to.
ANGEL: Thing about a game face, Lilah: you wear it long enough, it stops being something you can put on and take off.
LILAH: (stunned) Wow. We've spent so much time and money on you. You're so pivotal to the coming cataclysm that I sometimes forget how dense you can be. The game face? The one I worked so hard to get? I became that years ago.

Lilah knows what team she signed up on. When Holland Manners is grooming wishy-washy Lindsey McDonald as his protégé, he is failing to notice the actual heiress to his worldview standing right beside him. I think that while Angel assuming Lilah's mission is a 'feminist thing' is incredibly rude, there is something of an undercurrent here. Does Holland pass over Lilah because she's a woman, and he can't really live vicariously through her ascension in the ranks of W&H? It's a possible reading. Holland is of an older generation of businessmen; he sees women as objects, largely, using Darla as a tool and throwing parties with his much-younger wife Catherine, whom the script for "Reunion" explicitly calls his 'trophy wife'. So it's possible to read Lilah's struggle for Holland's approval as a sort of exaggerated second-wave feminist enterprise; the woman entering the workplace with a gun in her purse.

But Lilah is never reduced to operating purely within a feminist framework. She's a more complicated figure than that, and the fact that she is a powerful woman declaring her own agency never overtakes her character. She is layered enough that when she fails or succeeds it never comes across as commentary on women or on feminism as a movement. Indeed, she is the only major female character to meet her death in a way other than 'killer pregnancy', so clearly she transcends her gender role even within the weirdly gendered context of heroic narrative in AtS.

Lilah is a person who chose evil. As a human being she has the prerogative to be good or evil, and she made her choice. She has absolutely no regret about that choice, nor does she feel she has to justify it to anyone. Part of what makes her so fascinating is that we know very little about her life pre-W&H; all we know is that she has some kind of inspiring story, as Bethany Chaulk implies as much in the plot of 2.04 "Untouched". Before Lilah's mother was revealed to be alive (if demented) in Season Three, Stephanie Romanov had decided that Lilah was an orphan who had grown up on the streets doing odd jobs to survive. Even with the orphan bit retroactively removed, this is clearly a woman who grew up hard. Whatever speech she gave at Bethany's high school was about overcoming the odds to become something powerful. Unlike Lindsey, however, who offers his sob story to Angel in "Blind Date" as immediate justification for his presence at Wolfram & Hart, Lilah never feels a need to defend herself.

And in the end, Holland is right. There is a greater scheme to things, and some people need to be the bad guys. After all, this is what the Jasmine arc is largely about: without evil, there can be no good. That's not to suggest that it is admirable to be the bad guy, but somebody has to do it and Lilah has no issue with taking on that role.

On some level I think I love Lilah because she is Cordelia's antithesis. Both are self-centered, pragmatic to a fault and deeply materialistic, and these commonalities are the central comedy of their fantastic (and largely dramatic) scene together in "Billy", but while Cordelia comes to define herself by the mission, Lilah defines herself by self-interest. If Cordelia is the dying martyr suffering to make the world a better place, then Lilah is the determined sinner making the world work for her. I think there's quiet poetry in that, and when "Cordelia" (Jasmine) kills Lilah in "Calvary" it is this parallelism that makes the moment all the more shocking.

I think the moment that cemented my love for Lilah, the moment at which I decided she was in fact the best villain on the show, was in the climax of "Sleep Tight". Sahjhan has opened the rift to Quor'toth, and explains exactly what he will do if Connor does not die or get thrown into Quor'toth immediately. Without a moment's hesitation, Lilah orders her commandos: "Kill it."

Not him. It. I just. Lilah is so terrible and so great, and everything a sexy femme fatale should be: decidedly female without being soft.

Source

» wesley /lilah
» Lindsey//Lilah
» Angel&Lilah
» Lilah&Gavin
» Lindsey ou Lilah?